Continuing the conversation from part one here:

Her: So guy hit me in the face at a party because I told him he was being rude to my friend

*some

So his fuse is shorter than most

Me: when?

Her: A few months back

Me: how did you tell him?

what tone did you use?

Her: I told him he shouldn’t talk to her that way because he was being degrading

I was actually pretty friendly

It was a fun party, no need for conflict

Me: define pretty friendly

hold your thoughts for a minute

Her: Like I was smiling, light tone (tone I use with my mom)

Me: I am going to ask you questions about this

I want to you be as honest as possible

I am not trying to judge you

or him

Her: I was a good distance away, I wasn’t even holding much eye contact

Me: so how far is a good distance away

?

Her: Hmm about two feet?

Yeah, I was about 2 ft away

Actually, no. About 3

Me: okay

what was your tone

of voice?

Her: I don’t know how to describe tone of voice

Me: loud

quiet

Her: I was slightly tipsy, so bubblier than usual

Me: how loud was bubbly?

Her: I wasn’t yelling or anything, but audible

Me: ok

did you call him any names?

as in

Her: No, I said “Hey mister, I don’t think that’s a really nice way to talk to my friend”

Me: did you say those exact words

Her: Yes

Me: or did you command him to stop talking to your friend in a rude manner?

Her: Then he said “Fuck you, sand nigger” then hit me

No, I was just trying to get him to chill out

Me: did you say anything after “Hey mister, I don’t think that’s a really nice way to talk to my friend”?

Her: Nope

Me: was this the first time you or your friends said something to him to get him to stop being rude?

(Her Name)

Her: Yea, he was like standing over her and being sort of intense. Then she came to me and said he called her a cunt for not wanting to leave with him, so I confronted him

Me: you confronted him?

it sounds like you had confrontational intent

even though you were in a bubbly mood

Her: By confront I mean approached him and said what I told you

Me: ok

now

I think I can break things down for you

1.

For what you’re dying to know, I’m sure

actually

one more thing

why did you confront him, instead of just avoid him the rest of the night?

Her: Because he wouldn’t leave my friend alone and she was getting really annoyed

Me: he wouldn’t leave your space?

or he wouldn’t stop talking in your direction?

Her: No, he followed us around the whole time

Me: oh alright

1. He was not right to punch you in the face for your request

which sounds reasonably put

I imagine he a) doesn’t know how to interact with girls very well (the following you around despite repeated rejections)

and b) does or did not have a male role model

to teach him how to manage him emotions

the reason why I asked you those questions

is because things happen under the hood that you don’t realize

if you call him a name when you ask him to stop doing something

you’re calling him out

and inviting a fight

if you tell him to stop doing something, he thinks. “Who the fuck are you to tell me what to do?”

and now you’re gotta prove you’ve got the authority

if you get in his face or use a loud tone of voice

whether you realize it or not

you are using signals men use, consciously or unconsciously

to let other men know that a fight is a comin’

if you choose to confront him rather than avoid him or switch bars

you are choosing the fight option of the “fight or flight response”

and he recognizes that subconsciously

now

Her: Yeah

Me: if any of what I say doesn’t make that much sense

imagine yourself

if you were a guy

and you did one of the things I mentioned

it makes a whole lot more sense, right?

Her: Yeah it does

Me: what I am really getting across to you

is that

you’re getting treated like a guy

Her: The thing is, I’m a really non-confrontational person

Me: you’re getting treated equally

Her: So I was really surprised

Me: I know you’re a non confrontational person

yes

there’s a combination of factors in this

I can tell you all of them

Her: And my dad makes it clear what can be taken as threatening posture, eye contact, voice etc because he is really aggressive

Me: but the very basic stuff

I can’t tell you all of them

yeah

well there’s more

Her: And I’m very vigilant of that, so I’m always aware when I’m asking for it or when I’m backing down

Me: true

I don’t doubt it

the point I am getting at

is choosing to confront

is aggressive intent

no matter how you go about it

because you are still indirectly saying,”Stop talking to/bothering my friend”

combined with a low fuse and/or a lack of ability to control emotional response or tell what a healthy reponse is

makes this sort of thing happen

do you understand what I am getting at?

Her: Yes

I understand

Me: even when you are doing everything right

there can still be some factor you don’t know about or didn’t plan for

now, going through this conversation

I can think of one other thing that was in play if you want to hear it

Her: Yes please

Me: so

that guy

on a basic level

he was following his biological imperative

and persuing a mate

even if clumsily and unskilled

what you would call creepy

or scary

depending on how he looked

I imagine you would say creepy

am I right?

Her:  (Rapey, is the term she used)

Me: hmmm

what did the guy look like?

tatoos?

muscular?

stupid?

smart?

chainz

gansta clothes?

Her: Really big build, about 6’2″, neglecting lower body and fully built with upper body, seemed fairly stupid, probably part of a frat

Me: ahh…………………………….

well

that’s a part of it

my point is

when you confronted him

you are directly getting in the way of him pursing his mate

which on an animal level

encourages him to compete for his mate

and when he is 6’2″

Her: Well I don’t think hitting me is helping him get any

Me: no

it’s not that he thinks hitting you will get him laid

on a very primal level

you are stopping him from pursuing a mate

when men are stopped from pursuing mates

the animal response is to fight

unless the person stopping the man is bigger

you confronted a 6’2″ frat boy

who saw you as little threat

what I am saying

is

you did everything you thought right

but on a simple level

you confronted him

and he dealt with you as he would some other opponent

you told me how you were suprised he hit you right?

you didn’t think he would hit you right?

you acted non threatening and did not act hostile

Her: I didn’t think he would even get mad! I wasn’t being remotely rude

Me: I know

it’s a very primal thing that is hard to understand

Her: It’s fine, I think I got it

Me: even though I am loathe to say it

the correct response would have been to get a bouncer to deal with him

or get him ejected from the club/bar

Her: Yeah

Me: I don’t expect you to agree fully with everything I say

or understand every little detail or nuance

but I’m glad you can talk about it and understand most of it

Question for you

Do you mind if I use this conversation as an example to other female friends of mine

?

Her: Oh go ahead

Me: Thank you

Her: If they can learn as much as I did from it, then I’d be happy to oblige

Me: I won’t use your name, just the points I explain in it

Her: Haha yeah that’s fine

Me: the funny thing is

you do better than most girls

your thought processes are better on this

but even you get flak when you miss the parts people don’t teach you about

like what I try to explain now

Her: Yeah, well like I said, my dad tries to give me basics

Me: yep

one more thing before I go

in our conversation

on facebook

I gave you a warning shot

you don’t always get a warning shot

if the guy has been drinking

if he’s pissed off

if he doesn’t have a role model to explain him to give one

or if the guy looks like a thug/frat boy/low intelligence

Make sense?

Her: Yes sir

Me: Alright

I have an exam

take care

Her: Good luck

And thanks for the advice

Me: You’re welcome

Bye

It appears that as women are being taught to act more masculine and men are taught to act more feminine, girls get surprised when they get treated like guys. It appears to me that their idea of being treated equally is just being treated like a girl and their idea of how to act like a guy is a bastardized version of what they see. Incidents like the female marine getting body slammed to the ground and dying when she starts a fight come to mind.

It’s my hope that more girls realize that not can they not truly be men, but that they don’t really want to be either. A lot of trouble would be averted if they understood better what was going on, or at least understood that they don’t really know how men work, and don’t get into fights because they think they do.

~Wald

I was talking to a female friend on Facebook today, who I frequently joke around with. I knew her from when she briefly went to high school with me and I’ve kept in touch with her ever since.

Every now and then I talk to her about things I cannot help but insert my new red pill views in conversation when ever I hear her spout blue pill platitudes. She talked about hitting a man if he looked at her “like a steak” which launched this conversation:

Her: If a man ever made that kind of face at me, I would happily kick him in the crotch

That’s not true though, because creepy black guys at my past uni did and I never had the courage to do it

Me: probably because they would hit you back

Her:…I never thought of that

Me: why not?

Her: I don’t know, I just never thought of anyone hitting a girl

Given, I could probably take a guy

Me: well

Her: I just can’t imagine someone actually hitting a girl

Me: if some girl hit you

wouldn’t you hit her back?

Her: Well yeah

Me: so why is it different for a guy?

Her: Well, if I hit a guy, it would be fair to hit me back

But if he looked at me like a steak

Things wouldn’t go so smoothly

Me: then you look at him like a steak back

Her: Hahaha

Me: doesn’t warrant punching him

Her: Pull a knife out

Me: punishment doesn’t fit the crime

Her: I never thought of it that way

Me: welcome to the real world sugah

Her: I don’t like the real world. I prefer my mind where I can hypothetically beat up 150+ lb men

Me: as long as you keep your imaginary world rules to yourself, that’s fine

but when you apply that logic to the real world

you get suprised

this shit happens

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=wsJRKDpqX6Y

She didn’t talk to me or initiate conversation for a while after that.

However I commented on a photo of hers today, that showcased a funny face just to poke fun, but I ended up starting an important conversation that I think all girls should read. Some of the initial conversation got deleted because she overstepped a line and got scared when I pushed back, so I am summarizing from memory.

It started out relatively innocent banter about her photo:

Me: Trollface approves this picture.

Her: You’re gonna get punched.

Me: You’ll probably punch my rock hard abs, sprain your wrist, and suffer a hearty bout of troll laughter.

Her: I’ll probably break your nose and suffer the pain that way.

Her: Rock hard abs? Who are you kidding?

Me: I’d probably headbutt your punch and break your knuckles like I have done others.

Her: Well that escalated quickly.

Me: You’re talking about punching me in the face. You gotta be careful how you talk about that. You say the wrong word in the wrong sentence and I go from trollface to warface.

Warface does not acknowledge rules, handicap itself against the weak, restrain itself in the interest of chivalry, or give pause to the weary.

Her: I got scared as soon as I read the first sentence.

She then messaged me to apologize for offending me, which kick started a whole conversation that’s been waiting to happen:

Her: Sorry I offended you Thomas

Me: Just gotta careful when you play with fire, Youmna

Her: Okay  I’m sorry, I learned my lesson

Me: When you told me how you never thought about getting hit back as a girl

This is what happens when you act under the assumption that you don’t get hit back

I enjoy your company and your friendship

so in the grand scheme of things it’s not a big deal

and really

you’re only encountering strong words

but I want you to know

the beneath the surface of every nice guy you meet and know

there is an underlying violence

different guys have differing levels of control of this violence

and different things can trigger it

Her: Ok

Me: talking about fighting

even in play dances a subtle line around this

guys play fight all the time

the play dominance games

call each other bad names when it’s really endearing

Her: But why would they play fight if it could trigger a real fight?

Me: some guys even become best friends after a fight

Her: What? How?

Me: as a girl you don’t recognize the subtle rules

well

for example

when two guys are wrestling

or play fighting

they don’t use all their strength

they learn this when they are younger

by playing with friends

or family

usually you’ve got some male family role models

but

the minute you use all your strength

shit gets real

Her: Sort of like puppies

Me: you have precious little time to apologize

and explain you are only playing

before words go out the window

and the animal fight or flight response comes in

Her: I’m so happy I’m a girl

Me: the same dynamic is present in words

a battle of wits

“Hey faggot”

“Shut up asshole, I’ll punch you in the teeth”

“Yeah right, you’d sprain your wrist”

etc

etc

Her: Yeah…

Me: I can’t explain how it works exactly

Her: But what if I’m just teasing?

How does the line work there?

Me: Well

you were teasing when you said that I was gonna get punched

it doesn’t specify where

how hard

etc

playful

but when you mention breaking my nose and your hand hurts because you punched me so hard

it sounds like a fights coming

Her: Oh

Me: immediately I came up with my response

of breaking your knuckles

in a sense

I was still playing

but it’s more of warning you that things are escalating

Her: Oh! Okay! I seeeee

Me: you back off and things smooth over

you don’t back off

and even though intellectually I know you are teasing

and my friend

are not a threat to me

or trying to be

subconsciously

you become one

and my thoughts turn from

“How to troll Youmna”

to

“How to break every bone in Youmna’s body so that she will be no threat in the present or the future”

Her:…well then, I need to watch myself

Me: yes

Her: Sorry Thomas

Me: most girls don’t understand how this dynamic works

Her: I promise I didn’t mean anything by it

Me: I accept your apology and I know you didn’t mean anything

your punishment is this lenghty explanation

I also explain this to you so you don’t accidentally trip me off

or some other guy

the worst part

is you are in America

where a lot of guys subdue this part of their nature

and they act girly

or have little male influence

or few male role models to teach them how to manage their nature

so that their nature doesn’t manage them

Her: Yeah

Me: in one sense

these guys are pussies

and hardly ever lash out

they’re submissive

and put up little to no fight

but they still have the nature

it’s just harder to tell when it will come out

and they don’t know how to control it

look at the recent shooting

single mother

no male role model

socially awkward

probably feminized

I do not condone what happened

but I recognize it as fighting back

that’s how long his fuze was

Her: Yeah

Me: because he had no outlet for these increasing feelings

they manifested themselves in a murderous spree

Her: I guess just cause my friends here are so mellowed out, they never seem bothered by my teasing

Me: most of the time they aren’t

Her: But I’ll definitely watch what I’m saying so it doesn’t seem threatening

Me: but that’s the dangerous part

because you don’t see any repercussions

even small ones

you forget that there are and can be repercussions

Her: Yeah

Me: the simple thing I am going over with you

is the obvious stuff

I am not like most guys in America

I would say I have a shorter fuse

but I am more aware of it

and I can manage it to an extent

Her: So you respond better to hugs

Haha

Me: oh

I didn’t follow for a minute

well

as long as you get my point

Her: Yes I do

Me: we can defuse the serious atmosphere this talk has

Her: But matter is, I won’t know everyone the second I meet them. So I shouldn’t test their fuse by using harsh wording. Because someone could have a short fuse and not know how to control it

Me: yes

She then talked about her experience of getting hit in the face by a guy in a club. I asked her about that in another conversation. You’ll have to see part two of this post, because there’s too much in here for just one post.

~Wald